Resolved 76561198050006597 Muselk

Muselk, please add me on steam so we can talk about this.
http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198044435721/ is my profile in case you cannot find it.

Hidden Content:

**Hidden Content: Content of this hidden block can only be seen by members of (usergroups: Legacy Trade Moderator).**

 

Hidden Content:

**Hidden Content: Content of this hidden block can only be seen by members of (usergroups: Legacy Trade Moderator).**

 

Friends list is full sadly. And I cant really remove anyone without feeling like a dick.

Ive given you guys all the facts. Borrowed it for 2 days, returned it, if that merrits me being marked as a scammer when Ive #1 not scammed anyone or #2 assisted a scammer in anyway then thats your prerogative, as someone who doesnt trade it doesnt effect me personally, although marking someone as a scammer, who pretty clearly isnt certainly wouldnt bolster the credibility of steamrep.

Really nothing more I can contribute to the discussion. Facts on the table, Ill leave it to you guys.

 

Well, let me say it like this then.
You have 7 days to add me on steam, if you haven't done it by then this report will be concluded.

 

Guess you can just rep me then haha. There is literally nothing I could tell you on steam that I havnt already told you. You have literally 100% of the facts infront of you. I didnt scam it, I didnt benefit a scammer in any way by borrowing it for 24 hours, and adding you would achieve nothing, so right now you just look like a child who wants to get his way.

No need to wait a week. The facts of what happened arnt going to change.

I dont trade, so it doesnt effect me in the slightest. More just degrades the repuation of steamrep marks. Have a nice day

 

You do understand that if you are marked any donations given to you or you do giveaways any trades you commit can be "trading with marked users" and give them a warning or caution or a mark as well.

Even if u get someone else to do it for you its still the same thing.
So you may not care for your reputation but you should atleast consider your viewers and followers.

Even if you made a mistake please add downie we only wish to gather some more information which only you can provide.
If of course you still feel like this is a bad system so be it.. But we are trying to talk to you to resolve this.

 

As I said, full friends list, and Im not going to be a dick and remove someone. You have 100% of the facts at your disposal, I cant see what else you would need. and there's nothing about the case I could tell you over steam messages that I havnt already told you. I #1 didnt scam anyone, or #2 assist a scammer in any way, but if your going to MARK me as a scammer then thats your guys decision.

You should decide the outcome based on what happened, and you guys know exactly what happened.

Cases should be concluded in the open, not behind private messages.

 

We wanted to keep your personal information private as we were going to ask the following. We don't mark unnecessary unless u withhold proper evidence for potentially trading with scammers as well as not cooperating.

Please provide the following if you don't wish to add any one of us.
A full screenshot of your PayPal activity page (if you didn't purchase it via PayPal we want to make sure)
A full screenshot of your item inventory history showing the URL as well is mandatory to verify it is your account. Need to see both trades of you receiving and trading away the burning tc in question as well as nothing was paid for it.

If you want to cooperate with us and everything I asked for is uploaded on our Fortress of Gamers - File Hosting page and then you can copy n paste the screenshots which are uploaded on your next post for proper evidence.
We haven't decided what to do in your scenerio. We aren't quick to jump the gun either. Nor are we not giving you chances. So please do not make it seem like we don't care nor that we don't know how to do our jobs.

If you still wish not to cooperate and withhold what I have asked. You have ruined your own reputation on your own and shouldn't blame us for it.

 

Eh honestly kinda done dealing with it tbh. As I said, not too concerned about being marked. My paypal has a lot of private stuff that Im not comfortable sharing, through PM or otherwise.

Its quite clear I didnt buy anything, otherwise I would still have the hat. I guess Ill just clarify next time I do a giveaway that people shouldnt participate if they're worried about a FOG mark (Im assuming youll mark anyone who trades with me?). As for seeing the trades, you can see that it was in my BP, and now its in another persons BP.

My reputation is in the clear. Nobody is really going to believe that Im a scammer when my BP value has done nothing but decline for the past 3 years through all the giveaways that I do. Do whatever you guys think is right.

Every other site, from backpack.tf to steamrep has come to the obvious conclusion that Im not a scammer, Its just you guys, who are at this stage ruining your own reputation and degrading the value of your own scammer marks.

 

You really think these guys want to mark you? Do you really have hundreds of users that you talk to daily? Could you not remove one, talk to this admin, and readd that friend after? What's the big deal? By refusing to cooperate with these patient community staff members, you are insulting them greatly. They put hard work and effort into what they do, and you should respect them for that as they do of you. What have you got to hide on your Paypal? This doesn't help yourself look any less suspicious.

You should be ashamed of yourself for acting like this, if you truly cared about yourself and more importantly your subscriber base you'd get off your damn high horse, add this admin, and this this shit sorted. The moderators and staff are being more than fair to you, and you fail to see that.

I'm not saying you should be marked, in fact I disagree with that. I just fail to see why someone like yourself wouldn't do something so simple to save yourself so much hassle.

 

This has to be satire.

It is ridiculously easy to edit pages' HTML. Right-click, inspect element, delete element. Boom, you've removed a PayPal transaction and can now take a screenshot "proving" you didn't do anything!

Are you fucking stupid? Muselk has to prove he DIDN'T FUCKING PAY FOR THE HAT? Do you have ANY concept of "innocent until proven guilty?" The onus is on YOU to prove that HE PAID FOR THE HAT. That is NOT on him.

You can't seriously be about to mark Muselk. The guy doesn't even TRADE. You're clearly just looking for any opportunity to apply the letter of the law so you can show that you're NOT ABOVE MARKING FAMOUS PEOPLE and that EVERYONE IS GUILTY. Bullshit. Fuck that. Muselk didn't aid scammers in any way, and it's up to you to fucking prove otherwise.

Jesus Christ.

 

Why does he need to give you paypal screenshots when he clearly was just borrowing the team captain... It's not even in his inventory... Why is he not allowed privacy...

 

Are you FOG? No. Are you Steamrep? No. Their site, their rules. Geel with it.

There is no need for the temper tantrum Geel, calm down and grow up LOL. If you wanted to post an opinion regarding the report that's fine, but there is no need for the insults.

FOG doesn't mark based upon opinions, regardless if that opinion is made by someone as respected as yourself. They mark based on evidence. Muselk is unwilling to provide such evidence and is unwilling to cooperate, so the way I see it, FOG is in the right here to do whatever they want as seen fit.

~Ready for the hate.

 

FOG can't just "do whatever they want" if they have the authority to effectively revoke someone's access to trading with 95% of the trader base as well as almost every single trading related website, are you fucking mental?

That'd be like saying that if scrap.tf had tags, we should be allowed to mark you because you broke the "don't be a shark" rule. Sorry, you're marked now! Our site, our rules. Except it's not just the one fucking site.

 

Once again, calm down with the insults. Pulling in an entirely unrelated topic of my sharking is unprofessional and uncool.

Honestly, if you wanted to mark me, go right ahead. I mean, you did ban Courtney for personal reasons didn't you? Your site, you can do what you want on it. And as posted earlier, Muselk pretty much asked for a mark from FOG. He doesn't care, why should you?

 

Yeah but "guilty until proven innocent" is pretty much against the vast majority of Western legal tradition. Hence why there is controversy around cases like this.

FoG does generally mark based on evidence, but as the "prosecutors" the onus is on them to get that evidence, not on the defendant to prove his/her innocence. At least, it would be in a court of law, which if we are honest places like this are the closest thing we have in the community. Of course, FoG doesn't necessarily operate by any rules that most of us would recognise from the legal sphere, but I think that is where the controversy is arising here, because there is a underlying "guilty until proven innocent" protocol.

 

Could you like not have a flame war on a report...

 

Ashamed of myself? High horse? I came here, made an account, explained exactly what happened and discussed it with them over several messages. The only point where I drew the line is when they started to request VERY personal information from me! My paypal account has a ton of stuff in it that Im not going to just forward to randoms on the internet. How would you feel if someone you dont know/ have never met asked to see every transaction you've made fro the past month? Ontop of that, as geel said, its a completely pointless thing to request, I could just go create a blank account and show 0 transaction, or alter the HTML. The second thing, trade history pics, you can clearly see that It was in my BP, and now its not, its back in the original owners BP. You dont need trade shots to see that. At this stage it just looks like theyre requesting whatever personal info they can so that Ill add them. So both things that they've requested are completely meaningless and wont move the investigation any further. But by all means, if you guys want a picture of a blank paypal account ill be more than happy to oblige.

EVERY other site has been mature enough, and smart enough to come to the conclusion that I didnt scam anyone, and that im not a scammer, its blatantly obvious. At this stage all this has become is two admins stubbornly wasting my time, when frankly I have better things to do. So no, im not going to send them all my personal info, and if anyone is curious about whether im a scammer or not, Ill just direct them to backpack.tf.

 

Hey @Muselk , I want to clarify something to you , to geel and to everyone else that reads to this thread. When you receive a Tag it does not say "Scammer" it says "Banned by x[community appying the ban]" - it's says that because it does not mean that your a scammer, it means that you violated our policies in a way that we think your a problem to the community and that you should be banned- 99% of them receive it because they scammed but others get it for trading with scammers, etc...
I know that you all say "whats the problem of trading with a banned user?" - if you trade with a person that is banned (knowingly) your helping him make profit of stolen goods- TF2, CS:GO ,Dota 2 items that represent money, real money, we see so many people that earn money with them - people that own sites (like you Geel) , people that sell items for money daily , etc... We also hear about kids that ask their family to give them money in their birthdays to buy items, I can keep giving examples of why items represent money but my point is, do you think you guys should trade with scammers? Trading with marked scammers, it's no diferent that buying a selphone from a guy in the street - of course you know it's not legit but some people risk their reputations for it- note that in Portugal you can get in trouble for buying stolen goods, probably in other several countries too.

We at FoG , don't like marking people for trading with scammers, we all said it- but we go with the SR policies and we do our best to investigate them and we only Full Tag when a person clearly does not care about our policy and keeps trading with marked scammers. Please read this: http://forums.f-o-g.eu/threads/7071-trading-scammers-report-process.html

@Muselk , we tried since the day one to get in touch with you , you gave us few posts telling your version of the story, but with if I may say - they were full arrogance and "I don't give a fuck" attitude. Also note that you never decided to cooperate with us , is this going to affect our judgement? Your attitude no but your inability to cooperate probably.

Our main problem is that you got the item knowingly that the guy was banned and you simply didn't care about. You choose to trade with him anyways...

I'm going to lock this thread and gather with trade moderators to talk and provide a verdict- if anyone has doubts or anything to add, please add me on steam.

Hidden Content:

**Hidden Content: Content of this hidden block can only be seen by members of (usergroups: Legacy Trade Moderator).**

 

Hey @Muselk , I'm going to unlock this report and ask you for your collaboration. We did our research (with your help too) and we can confirm that you indeed returned the Burning Team Captain. However we couldn't figure out what happened to the following 2 items: Orbiting Planets Your Worst Nightmare and Knifestorm Modest Pile of Hat- Therefore I would like to ask you for information about them and in case that you don't have them any more, I would kindly ask you for a screenshot of the trade history. Did you received them as a gift, to make another sketch or to donate them to your streamers? Please enlighten us about those two items. Thanks in advance.